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Is reslling now dead - a technological anachronism?

Posted by Mach4-Chris, 08-06-2011, 01:43 PM
I have long since pondered this question and continue to do so. You might as well read my comments in this thread to get the gist of what I am saying and then return here to discuss. My own view is that reselling, specifically hosting reselling, is pretty well technologically passe and defunct leaving too many, mistakenly, to believe it is still a worthy investment of their time. I say, "time", because financial investment, in so far as the whole reseller uptake is concerned, is scarcely on the part of the reseller. The entrance fee is negligible with the provider assuming the entire capitalisation of provision. Otherwise well established hosts, InnoHosting, for example, have based their entire business model upon reselling and appear not to acknowledge that the old, 'reseller' model is by now pretty well redundant. What will happen to such companies and how will they respond to changing times, if all? I look forward to the debate.
Posted by Server Management, 08-06-2011, 02:21 PM
I wouldn't say reselling (reslling) is dead just depends on how you market your offerings...
Posted by HostXNow_Chris, 08-06-2011, 02:48 PM
It is good for those who are serious about it. And yeah, it depends on the service you provide and your offerings to name a few.
Posted by SuperVDS, 08-06-2011, 03:28 PM
VPS costs have come down a lot so there seams to be less resellers of web hosting. Sure not dead tho. But web hosting is just so cheap so people look at selling higher value services.
Posted by urbee, 08-06-2011, 03:38 PM
And what would you say is the "new" reseller model? Some people do not want to lease a VPS or a dedicated server as they need a system administrator for it.
Posted by Mach4-Chris, 08-06-2011, 05:20 PM
I don't believe there needs to be reseller model in this industry at all. My belief is that it is redundant and we are just seeing the dying embers. I believe that consumers have caught up, way beyond the extent to which the hosting industry has yet to acknowledge. People are much more savvy nowadays. If you consider the way that people, as opposed to the hosting industry (too slowly), are going, the average Joe feels patronised and almost insulted that they need to depend upon any reseller when they can go mainline themselves. If I am a web developer, I know that I get WHM and do my own thing and I really don't need to be told by anyone that I cannot. It is a fact. I simply can. I fail to see any role for a reseller of hosting services when there are so many great providers who can make available any scale or permutation of individual preferences. If you need the freedom, at any level, whatever your needs, albeit somewhat jailed, that is now an every day option. And the last thing people need is for a middleman reseller to make that possible. Mainstream hosts already make that and much more besides possible for any average Joe. Last edited by Mach4-Chris; 08-06-2011 at 05:23 PM.
Posted by Server Management, 08-06-2011, 05:22 PM
Sorry but that is absolute B.S...
Posted by vWiz, 08-06-2011, 05:34 PM
Reseller isn't really dead. A lot of web-hosting enthusiasts may not have the technical know to bypass the reseller level and jump right into VPS/Dedi (although managed solutions for vps/dedi exist), it may not be cost-effective for the user. On a business model for the Reseller Host itself, I don't think it's dead, actually far from it. The market is growing with consumers/hosts alike as more of the web is becoming "even more" mainstream. Blogs, sites, shopping sites, etc, all require hosting. Just need to find the right market and offer value.
Posted by Yujin, 08-06-2011, 07:40 PM
Mach4-Chris you keep saying that reselling is redundant...care to elaborate what makes it redundant in your POV? Please provide statistical comparison and not just a hunch then maybe I will agree with you. Come on let's go with your debate. --------- EDIT: By the way I noticed, that on the previous thread you underlined and link to InnoHosting then you did the same here. Is linking really necessary to discuss this matter? Last edited by Yujin; 08-06-2011 at 07:43 PM.
Posted by Sinoco, 08-06-2011, 08:43 PM
Cheap advertising I guess?
Posted by ArtieT, 08-06-2011, 08:47 PM
The marketing for reseller packages isn't so good. Not sure about the sales part of it.
Posted by Mach4-Chris, 08-06-2011, 09:05 PM
I only linked to InnoHosting because they happen to specialise in Reseller Hosting and it is that model I believe is long dead. That said, many others do, too. So, if you accept my model for the purposes of this debate, other than I truly believe the whole reseller is long since redundant just waiting for the dying gasps to catch up, please just ignore my reference to them. They are illustrative only. No biggy. Elaborating a little, though I am not going to provide justifications for my insights as it would take years, it may take more years for my 'insights' to gain acceptance and I care not for any of the usual 'die-hard' assaults we are accustomed to seeing on WHT. My insights are just my own personal insights. I stand by them and I am usually right about these things. (Can't believe I just said that though true.) That said, I am not a million miles out from being spot on and even that is not my point either. Being right can get nauseating and I am not saying I am, anyway. I'd be such a 'woos' though if I did not stand by my intuition. And I do stand by it. I reckon any host, right now, who bases their whole business model on a 'relic' reseller model will soon be eclipsed and left gasping by far greater technological advancements within the industry. More to the point, what is taking its' place? I already think I know. My question is, do you? As for statistical comparisons, are you kidding? I'll sleep on that and come back. Meanwhile, I'd quite like to hear the argument FOR what I claim is redundant. The model works today but that is all. I see no future in it. Last edited by Mach4-Chris; 08-06-2011 at 09:19 PM.
Posted by kpmedia, 08-06-2011, 09:14 PM
I think a lot of people used reseller hosts some 6+ years ago because it was one of the only ways to be able to host multiple isolated domains, with a panel, and give out tiers of access to users. cPanel's add-on system was inadequate, and VPS was extremely expensive. I had reseller accounts for most of the last decade, and that was the reason. Now I can just as easily run a VPS with any number of good panels (free or paid), or take out several cheap shared accounts. And I do. I've never resold hosting. Not my line of work.
Posted by Yujin, 08-06-2011, 09:21 PM
Seriously my friend this is a very long reply but just going around in circle about your hunch. Not meaty enough to justify your so called apocalyptic future of reseller provider. But I guess everyone is entitled to their magical ball prediction thing.
Posted by HostJedi, 08-06-2011, 09:26 PM
Reseller success is tied to what they are reselling. If a reseller is only selling virtual hosting (whether thru a reseller package or individually), then they are probably treading water right now. If the reseller is selling the hot items right now, such as VPS and Cloud, or good old standards that should never completely go away...like Dedicated Servers, they are probably doing just fine. The resellers need to change with the industry, not just the data center owners / backend providers needing to keep with the times. It is no different than any evolving industry, that you need to stay current and up to date with your offerings. No one wants to buy a brand new 2005 vehicle, when can get a brand new 2011 vehicle, unless that 2005 model is so significantly less expensive, and still solves the users needs, and the 2011 does not have features/functions that would be required. . .
Posted by Mach4-Chris, 08-06-2011, 09:29 PM
How right you are. I concede my, "magical ball prediction thing", as you put it, may not appeal to those whose dreams are invested in a long since bankrupt model that time will surely tell is just that. Meanwhile, has it not occurred to you that, if I am right, there's gonna be a few disillusionments amongst both users and resellers? It is always the last resort of those who said flight was not possible to marginalise those who knew it was. Meanwhile........ I hope for a thorough debate from all persuasions! Last edited by Mach4-Chris; 08-06-2011 at 09:33 PM.
Posted by Yujin, 08-06-2011, 09:34 PM
Exactly this is correct.
Posted by JixHost, 08-06-2011, 09:39 PM
Innovation is what will keep costs from complete erosion. It's pertinent to keep up with whats leading edge and if you have the capacity or potential to lead it, you would be golden. As far as the plain vanilla hosting plans, you could do fine if you target a specific niche, such as a webmaster selling websites and hosting as an attachment.
Posted by ldcdc, 08-06-2011, 09:40 PM
From what I've seen activity in this subforum has decreased over the years, relative to others. The VPS section has stolen most of the attention. Personally, I find the VPS a stupid idea for selling hosting, and stupid for all those who are not technically inclined. That being said, everybody seems to be crazy interested in using cheap unmanaged VPSes for all sorts of purposes, and learn the technical stuff as they go. The end result, I'm afraid, is overall more insecurity, more amateurism and risky behavior.
Posted by Mach4-Chris, 08-06-2011, 09:50 PM
Some good discussion happening now from different angles so time for me to go to bed. @Idcdc I agree. Night.
Posted by Yujin, 08-06-2011, 09:55 PM
Obviously if the basis of your biz planning is fortunetelling then you are in a serious trouble. Why would someone get a VPS or Dedicated if they have a handful of customers to cover the expenses. This is the major failure of those who are pretending that they are in a right track because they are control freak. Sure control is good but why will someone replace revenue over control.
Posted by rv_irl, 08-06-2011, 10:55 PM
1 Reseller hosting, of course is not dead. We wouldn't provide it if it was a dead business. I don't mean to sound too defensive, and I know you're interested in simply debating this, but you have no statistical data or anything for that matter to base these statements on, apart from an opinion of one persons stand point amongst many. However we, as you said, are an established host, of which one service we heavily specialise in is reseller hosting - do have statistical data, hard factual information and are right on the frontline to know exactly how it's performing. The number of people we have had that are moving to us from a dedicated server is astounding. Customers that don't want the headache of managing a server, managing security and whatnot. Those that want things to just work. Those are the ones that buy reseller hosting. So many popular web hosts on these forums you see all started from our reseller plans. For some, it's a stepping stone which removes the financial barriers of entry into the industry, for others it's a completely managed service. A lot of our customers buy multiple accounts, some have 10 reseller accounts, some have 5 reseller accounts. Some of our customers have purchased dedicated servers from us and have asked us to lock them down and only give them reseller privileges because they don't like the hassle associated with managing your own infrastructure. They prefer to have us manage it all for them so that they can focus on their core business. Taking a step back, what are the mainstream hosting services? - Cloud hosting - This all just the underlying infrastructure so the actual service is still the same - VPS - A micro server - Dedicated Server - a more liberal form of reseller hosting - Colo - Same as dedi. Put reseller hosting in the mix and you'll find it's actually a very appealing option in contrast to the others. There will always be a period of some favouring other services over reseller hosting, however at the end of the day, after a customer has tasted another service and has realised it's not for them - they turn back to what has proven to work, and proven to be reliable (assuming they go with a reputable host) - And that's reseller hosting. The term reseller hosting is just a wrongful defacto name which I believe misrepresents the actual purpose of it. Another wrongful perception is that to be a 'real host', you need to have a dedicated server - couldn't be further from the truth. Your infrastructure does not dictate how serious you are - you as an individual and business owner dictate how serious you are. Reseller hosting has evolved with the industry just like any other service. Last edited by rv_irl; 08-06-2011 at 11:00 PM.
Posted by Yujin, 08-07-2011, 01:39 AM
Hi Rameen, this info is really nice to know ---------------- OP, I guess Rameen explained everything.
Posted by AvailHosting-Jeff, 08-07-2011, 03:31 AM
There are tons of hosting consumers who manage multiple websites and do not know how to properly manage a virtual private server. These consumers are well-served by reseller hosting services where they do not need to worry about the management of the server. Reseller hosting is by no means a defunct hosting segment.
Posted by Forward Web, 08-07-2011, 07:32 AM
Interesting topic, this is actually the first time I have ever heard someone refer to the reseller aspect of web hosting, becoming dead. Personally, I think its growing and will continue to grow as long as there is the internet. Its definitely over-saturated (especially with all these Alpha/Master reseller plans), but that does not mean it is dead, not by a long shot.