Whose responsibility is it?

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Posted by wolvyreen, 12-04-2013, 05:01 AM
Hi All, This is a bit long winded but I need to put things in context. please try and endure to the end. I had an interesting "clash" with one of my clients today. On our servers, we implement a spam platform call "Spam Experts". This software works VERY well. However, as you know that from time to time, the spam filters always block some amount of legitimate spam. This is not always avoidable in every situation. The client contacted me in an ABSOLUTE fuss and fume complaining that we were preventing them from gathering ALL the business that they could possibly be doing due to some emails being blocked as spam. I explained that the mails were probably sitting in their quarantine folder and they would need to go in and monitor their box from time to time to release legitimate mails. Further more, I explained to the client that this is standard practice in the industry to have some form of method to combat spam and that there is always a possibility of mails becoming blocked and they simply need to release the mails. The client stated that 90% of their mails they receive have statements like: "30% discount" "market trends" etc etc etc I explained that sometimes a spam filter would deem this as spam and block the mail. They simply need to whitelist the domain. This did not sit well with the client because they argued that "being an advertising agency" they could not possibly know who and what domain their mails were going to be coming from and they couldn't go whitelisting EVERY domain. The client proceeded to threaten me and accuse me of preventing them from doing business on some levels and started berating me by warning me not to make her angry and that I do not want to see her angry. They DEMAND that I completely disable the spam filter on their account and in her own words "NEVER EVER block ANY emails sent to our account" and proceeded to imply that I will wish I never made them angry. I proceeded to tell this client to please calm down and to realise that I do not take kindly to threats and that I have a "Torturous Conduct" clause in my ToS and that they must please try and be more courteous and respectful. Of course, I was met with the client slamming the phone down in my ear. I am completely dumbfounded by this as I do not feel I have done anything wrong. My question is simple, who's responsibility is it to make sure the client get's all the legitimate emails that have been blocked? I can't possibly go through EVERY clients quarantine box and release mails I think are legitimate?? What do you think? Last edited by wolvyreen; 12-04-2013 at 05:05 AM.
Posted by PCS-Chris, 12-04-2013, 05:33 AM
The customer is always right. From our point of view they should absolutely be whitelisting their domains, or contacting us to say "Hey we are going to be sending X type of emails, is there any settings you need to check", but as we all know too well many business clients have no interest to get involved with the technical side of things, they just expect something that works and get s****y when things dont work. In this situation I would disable filtering on their account (If that's possible with spamexperts), or ask for a list of every domain they use and whitelist it. Case closed. The customer may be in the wrong but at the end of the day it's down to you to keep them happy. Theres always awkward customers like this nomatter what industry you are in. No need to get worked up about it and both parties are happy with the outcome.
Posted by wolvyreen, 12-04-2013, 05:45 AM
hi Chris, I have disabled the filter now but I do fear that this puts unnecessary extra load on the mail server now having to serve these unwanted emails to the client. But hey, if they want them that's on them and thankfully it's only one client and not a mass of them. I don't agree with the philosophy of "the customer is always right" even if they are wrong. Even on this platform there was a newsletter that went out saying it's ok to fire your clients from time to time. For reference purpose here are a few articles and I totally agree with them: http://click.inetinteractive-email.c...f5202d79fd7b04 http://www.searchenginejournal.com/w...-client/42426/ http://multichannelmagic.com/06/when...our-customers/ These are just SOME reasons to "fire your customer". I'm just not prepared to put up with abusive people no matter HOW much I wish to keep them happy. Oh, and my question was actually:
Posted by PCS-Chris, 12-04-2013, 06:23 AM
Yes it is OK to fire/cancel clients if they are abusive. Been there done that, at the end of the day its your company. "the customer is always right", is about treating a customer the same way nomatter how they are acting. e.g. Telling them to calm down in a situation like this is just giving fuel to the fire and doesnt help either of you. There is absolutely no point in getting worked up about it , if you can - resolve the issue (Regardless of whether or not the customer is wrong), and if you cant provide a solution or if they have been abusive / are not worth keeping in your eyes then part ways. That's my take on handling these situations anyway, it's nothing new and is just part of running any business. Push them over the edge and you may have a female hulk on your hands Last edited by PCS-Chris; 12-04-2013 at 06:26 AM.
Posted by wolvyreen, 12-04-2013, 06:25 AM
Thanks Chris, but my question still needs answering.
Posted by PCS-Chris, 12-04-2013, 06:29 AM
It's yours, you are the hosting provider and you are providing the service. Of course you cant guarantee that 100% of legitimate email will get through all of the time, but if messages are being dropped, the customer reports it and it's your responsibility to determine why. That's all you can do. If they have specific requirements that mail is not dropped, work with them and create filters/exceptions as needed to prevent it. If they are sending loads of adverts with common marketing keywords then look at getting them on an external mailserver if needsbe.
Posted by foobic, 12-04-2013, 06:38 AM
I doubt it would put extra load on the server. Quite the opposite if anything - spam scanning is usually rather resource-intensive. But I do wonder if you'll get another complaint shortly about the mountain of spam she's now receiving. And yes, it's perfectly ok to fire the client if you get to the point where you feel you can no longer work together. In this case I'd probably give her another chance - everyone's entitled to a bad day - but if it continues then there's really no other choice. By removing the filter on request you've already fulfilled your responsibility. Of course you can't manually check all filtered mail - even if you wanted to it would be an invasion of privacy.
Posted by wolvyreen, 12-04-2013, 06:40 AM
So, I have clients. They receive mails. A mail gets blocked by the spam filter that is legitimate. Now I must go through every single one of my clients quarantined mailboxes on a DAILY basis and release mails manually without them even complaining first because "It's mine"? What's the purpose of giving my clients a cPanel interface to control their ENTIRE account and they don't use it themselves?? So have you employed someone to monitor the quarantined boxes for you?
Posted by PCS-Chris, 12-04-2013, 06:46 AM
Don't be silly that's not what I meant at all. IF and when a customer reports a problem its your responsibility to fix it.
Posted by wolvyreen, 12-04-2013, 06:48 AM
Fixing a problem when a customer calls I have no problem with that. But I would rather teach the customer to examine his spam box on a regular basis so that I don't have to fix it every time he is waiting for a mail. What I was trying to tell you is that this client was implying that I was intentionally blocking their mails because some legitimate mails were being blocked due to particular phrases that the spam algorithm determined to be high risk. Thus, they said I must go and release the mails for them.
Posted by VMakerHOST, 12-04-2013, 07:30 AM
You can provide tutorials to them
Posted by Dave W, 12-04-2013, 09:50 AM
If they don't want antispam services then don't provide them with antispam services. Honestly they will likely come crawling back after a period of time requesting that you re-enable it. As far as the customer treating you poorly that's simple. Put up with as much as you are willing to put up with. Always be nice, but don't put up with a verbal beating if you don't want to. That doesn't mean attack them back it just means that your have the right to decide that you don't want to do business with a certain person/company if you don't want to.
Posted by Theseeker, 12-14-2013, 03:50 PM
You are a service provider. Client requested you provide the service of passing all emails sent to their address with no spam filtering. So just do it. It is an unusual but not unreasonable request and not a great effort to accomplish. Although I suspect after a while they may want some spam filtering. Then help them get it working they way they need and go sell your customized filter service to other companies in their industry.
Posted by JixHost, 12-14-2013, 05:07 PM
I've personally asked a few customers to leave over the years. Its a two way street, clients have choices of many providers and providers have many choices for clients. We are extremely helpful and loyal to our customers, however there are some that we will exercise our right to refuse service. If the client is reasonable, work with him. If not, ask him to fin another host. Its that simple. Sprint did something similar a few years ago and stopped serving over 1000 clients. http://www.foxnews.com/story/2007/07...nce-customers/
Posted by The Pro Host, 12-14-2013, 05:24 PM
Both you and the customer. I have had the same sort of problem, but as soon as it was reported to me I fixed it and that was the end. You don't need to look at the spam filters, just fixx It and it should be fine
Posted by Fixago, 12-23-2013, 03:54 PM
Are you a web hosting provider or email provider? I wouldn't want a host to filter my email, that's my responsibility. If I don't like your mail service, there's 10 other companies I can use (from free to paid). And honestly, it's in the client's best interest to NOT use their web host as their email provider, but a third-party service specifically geared towards email only (i.e. what if your servers go down, now their email is down, and email is extremely important to have at a highly available level).
Posted by Forward Web, 12-24-2013, 10:31 AM
I think the real issue he is not necessarily the question you asked, but where you should draw the line as a provider in terms of being respected as a human being. I think every provider that has been in business for a particular length of time has dealt with these types of customers. The real question here is how bad do you need their business? Personally, I would not have made an issue of it, I would have gave the customer what they wanted (in this scenario) and then coached them on how they could filter spam if they choose to do so, along with explaining to them why spam filters are a standard practice. 9/10 clients will complain about spam, while 1/10 will complain about not getting every last bit of email. There are also other solutions (example, a Managed VPS) where you could essentially give them what they want without it effecting other users. Getting yelled at is not a pleasant experience, however at the end of the day, its a part of doing business. You cant turn away every customer that is in a bad mood or you will find your-self out of business and you cant let yourself get pushed around either (somewhere in the middle is where you want to be).
Posted by noobs, 12-27-2013, 09:51 AM
That's not what the quote mean. End of the day, it all depends on what the TOS/AUP said in conjunction with the government's law. If I was the client, I can see myself furious about it, if such service was promised to begin with. Nothing to do with server load etc. Last edited by noobs; 12-27-2013 at 09:54 AM.